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Engineered Hardwood Archives

October 1, 2007

Engineered Flooring Over Radiant Heat

Q: Are there any species of engineered hardwoods that should not be
used over radiant heat?

Thank you

A: Generally speaking you can use any species of engineered flooring when installing over radiant heat. Some species are more stable than others, but when using an engineered product it becomes less important about species. The key to making an engineered floor perform well over radiant heat systems is to ensure that the product has 5 or more plies along with quality construction which usually results in each ply being somewhat thicker.

Some manufacturers will suggest not to use a particular species (typically less stable species) over a radiant heat system because that species is too likely to expand and contract heavily due to heat changes. Always check with a manufacturer before putting any floor over a radiant heat system.

My other major piece of advice for you is to ensure you acclimate your floor well. I recommend acclimating for a week before installing your product.

October 11, 2007

Amendoim from BR-111

Q: We spent a lot of time researching wood and colors and finally decided upon Amendoim, we like the look of Oak and the hardness greater than oak. I found that there are three engineered options from BR111,

Amendoim 3" 5/16" Prefinished $3.19/sf
Amendoim 61/4" 5/16" Prefinished $3.19/sf
Amendioim 3 1/4" 3/8" Triangulo $6.09/sf

My question is what sets the Triangulo apart, why is it so expensive? Also when I looked up BR111 site for these it shows that the Triangulo version is more than double hard than OAK, whereas the regular Engineered wood hardness was shown same as OAK. I thought the hardness of the product is the same as the species, if the same species engineered prefinished product has different durability, hardness than it becomes very tricky in making our selection.

thanks
Ananth

A: Typically when it comes to an engineered product, Hardness is somewhat affected because the thickness of the species layers and plies will affect the floor's hardness. Keep in mind hardness is measure based on how much pressure is required to fire a ball bearing at the floor and bury it to half the ball's diameter in depth. Since some engineered products have thinner species layer than others (even when made by the same manufacturer) the hardness can vary even when the species itself is the same. Normally this change is when the species layer is a veneer (paper thin layer of wood) or thinner than roughly 1/8". This can also be affected by the quality of the engineered substrate as some manufacturers have lines which use a different substrate than poplar (the most common).

The best way to see the difference between these products is to order samples from BR-111's site. The nice part about BR-111 is that they offer up to 4 free samples of their products directly from their website www.br111.com, so you can easily order each of the ones you are looking at and compare them in your home. Triangulo is one of BR-111's better lines of engineered products (hence the price difference). From my experience with the Triangulo series, it is rather well built and I have had several customers who absolutely love theirs.

October 22, 2007

Westhollow White Oak Butterscotch 3/8" Engineered Installation Help

Q: Hello Ifloor Experts

I placed the order today (10/8/07) for Westhollow White Oak Butterscotch Engineered wood 3, 3/8 to be installed over concreted subfloor in my living room and a bedroom that's on above ground on the 1st floor of the house. I have a couple of questions in regards to the installation.

1. Has anyone used this floor, what are their thoughts about this floor?
2. I am going to use the floating installation method over concrete subfloor. Is that the best installation method for this wood or should I go with glue down application?
3. The flooring right now we have in the living room and the bedroom is Vinyl/linoleum and Carpet. If I go with the floating should I directly install the hardwood over vinly/linoleum or should I remove that floor and do it over concrete?
4. The room seems to slope, should I have this slope corrected before I install the hardwood? What material is used to correct the slope, where can I find it? How long does it typically take to correct the slope and how long should I let it dry before installing the hardwood?
5. I am probably going to receive the shipment on Thursday or Friday of this week (10/11 or 10/12), its going to rain this entire week until saturday, since I have already placed the order, I can't delay the shipment, would it be ok if I receive the shipment when there is rain? secondly, how long should I let the wood acclimate before installing it.


I have a house warming party on 10/20 and I am not sure if I have enough time between now and then to correct the slope, let the wood acclimate and have it installed before then. I want to get it done before the party on the 20th if possible though. Please advise.

Thanks,
Tejas Shah

A: Before we get too deep on your questions, let's talk timing. The environment change your floor will be going through as it ships to you will warrant a good acclimation time. I personally would suggest a week or more, but at a minimum you need to acclimate your product for 3-5 days. I also say this because you mention that you might have to deal with some rain when you receive the shipment. You should be ok to receive it while it is raining, just don't leave the flooring outside too long, try to get it in your home ASAP to avoid any risks.

For the slope in your floor this is dependent on where the slope is and how it affects the room. If the slope is completely even, meaning that it travels the entire width/length of the room at an even pace, then a floating install could simply go right over the top of the floor, but this is dependent on how steep the slope is. To correct the slope will depend on which subfloor portion it is. If this is located on our concrete subfloor, just pick up some self leveling compound at a local home store (Lowe's, Home Depot, etc) and use it per the instructions to correct the slope. If this slope is in your wooden subfloor, then you will need to get some thinner plywood to act as a shim, leveling out the subfloor by screwing in some additional wood. Then install your floor over it.

The floating installation method will work fine, but I would suggest using a good underlayment. The preference here would be to get a dense underlayment such as 3mm or 6mm cork. This will give your floor more stability especially along the edges. The installation method itself should work fine, but I would again stress using a dense underlayment because of the width of the product. Also, as long as the vinyl/linoleum you have is still firmly secured to your subfloor and there is no damage to it, then you should be fine installing your floating floor directly over it, but I would make sure to use a moisture barrier just to be safe in the concrete area.

As far as the Westhollow 3/8" engineered line is concerned it is a rather nicely built floor. The plies are relatively thick and the milling is done well. The big thing to keep in mind is that this is a tongue and groove product, so you will need to use a T&G glue in order to anchor each row of flooring to the next. When doing the installation, just put a small bead of the glue in the groove section of the plank, then slide the planks together so that they are snug.

Given this work, make sure to be realistic when budgeting your time. If your installation schedule would be rushed to make the party you're hosting, its a safe bet to simply hold off. Although having that great looking new floor (which the butterscotch definitely does look great) for house guests can give you something to show off your own hard work, you don't want to risk the floor's life span by rushing the job as replacing problems in the future is an aggravating and costly experience. My end all advice here is to budget your time well and don't be afraid to take additional time to ensure it is done right. Make sure that great looking new floor stays a great looking floor for as long as you own it.

November 13, 2007

3/4" Naildown on Concrete - Follow Up

I heard back from Gordon after his question about nailing down a 3/4" solid floor to concrete - so here's our follow up work with him.

Q: The only problem with the solution you provide is the additional height the 2x4s would impose. Even laid sideways, I still loose 1.5" in my room height and would have major adjustments to my doors.

Hmmm it seems the best solution is to not try the nail down stuff over concrete...

I was looking at the nail down stuff because it brought so much more selection. Maybe I just need to go with engineered.

What are your thought on the durability of the engineered vs. the solid? In engineered the is 5" widths (my wife loves) but the solids in 1/2" and 3/8" (glue down) only go to 3"

Gordon

A: I'm a big fan of engineered floors to be honest. Don't get me wrong, a traditional 3/4" solid really adds a certain appeal to any home, but engineered floors are designed for success in cases like yours. Here's the break down - the cross-ply lamination technique used to make engineered flooring vastly improves the floors dent resistance as well as prevents expansion and contraction. The cross-plies act as a form of checks and balances so to speak.

The reason why it is more common to find the wider planks in engineered versus solid is pretty basic. The wider a plank of wood gets, the less of that size you can get from a tree and thus price tends to go up. With a solid, the standard size for most domestic species (such as Oak, Maple, Hickory etc) is less than 3" (also called Strip flooring). However, with an engineered product, you need far less wood to make the top layer (referred to as species layer), so what normally would only make 1 plank of solid wood can now make 3 or more planks of engineered flooring - so wider planks become more common. The other reason behind the wide planks being common is that these are more dimensionally stable, which is key for engineered floors as they are usually meant to handle floating installations on top of nail or glue down applications. Strip flooring is not stable enough to pull off a floating installation.

There are several excellent manufacturers of engineered flooring: Award, BR-111, Bellefloor, Bruce, Kahrs, Saso, and Westhollow all have some great lines. With your particular installation, I would look into a floor you can float as this is much easier to install than a glue down application. If you get a high quality engineered floor and combine it with 3mm cork as a underlayment (as this will save on height vs 6mm) you'll get a great looking floor that will feel much like a 3/4" solid.

January 7, 2008

Basement Installation Question

Q: I live in New York and need to do my basement using wood flooring. Do I need to do anything other than what you have suggested? Should I buy certain type of wood Engineered wood? It is concrete in the basement, do I need to put something on top first? Thanks

A: This will be heavily dependent on the type of installation you wish to do. If you are going to purchase an engineered floor which can be floated, which I would suggest as this is the easiest install, you will need to use a moisture barrier and some seam tape. As far as product is concerned here, look at a product with a locking mechanism such as Kahrs or Saso. Both have excellent locking mechanisms, especially Saso's system which is very easy to install.

Install your moisture barrier and make sure to tape the seams effectively, especially up along the edges of the walls where your trim will be. This will ensure that you will have no issues with moisture coming up through your concrete slab into your floor.

If you are looking into a glue down application, all you will need is a good adhesive and to follow the adhesive's instructions. Typically this will mean allowing the adhesive to cure to a tacky consistency before laying your rows of flooring on the adhesive. Most adhesives will reach this point by the time you have laid out enough adhesive to cover about 60sf or so.

An important thing to keep in mind here is to allow for plenty of acclimation time in the basement. Give your floor a week or more to acclimate to the room as this will ensure far less issues post installation.

January 9, 2008

Wood Flooring Over Tile

Q: I have bought a house in Bella Vista, Arkansas. I would like to use engineered wood floors over the existing white ceramic tile. Can I do that or do I have to demolish the floor?. Second, can I use BR 111 engineered floor? if so, which one will be better, Dolomite or Triangulo? If neither one is good, can you advise that will be better over my existing ceramic title? I appreciate your expertise and thank you in advance for your response.


Sincerely,
Virgil W. Jackson

A: You can install a floating floor over tile as long as the tile is in good condition with no loose sections, but if you intend to do any other type of installation you will want to remove the tile first. The key to making this successful will be using a good underlayment. Keep in mind this means you will be raising the floor upwards of an inch or so. I would suggest using a 6mm cork underlayment here in order to get a nice dense underlayment that will hold up well over the tile. You may also want to lay down a moisture barrier to be safe, but its typically not necessary.

When installing over tile some folks will use a bit of self leveling compound to fill in grout lines if they are fairly deep, but if the difference in height from the grout line to the tile is minimal, this will not be needed.

For BR-111's lines, the Dolomites (formerly called Casanova) is simply a different species selection with a 4" board width whereas the Triangulo is either 3 1/2" or 5" in width. Personally I would go with the wider boards here and get either 4" or 5" (depending on what species fits your preference) as they are a bit more stable.

Another great engineered product you could look into would be Saso. Saso has quite a few nice exotics and the locking mechanism on Saso's wider board makes installation very easy.

Let's sum up: Floating floors will work over tile, but you will want to use wider boards and a very good dense underlayment. It might be necessary to use a moisture barrier or self leveling compound depending on the condition of your tile and depth of the grout lines.

January 20, 2008

Hollow Spots in a Bellefloor Maple Floor

Q: I just got 1100 sf of Bellefloor hard maple installed over concrete sub-floor. I had the installer put MVP sealer just to be on safe side. After the installation, I have about 15 hollow spots of varying sizes. Couple of them even squeak, I used an experienced and highly recommended installer.

What can I do now to fix this problem. The installer wants to drill the holes and force adhesive through it.

Please help.
bx

A: Based on your description it sounds like the subfloor was uneven and not leveled before installation began. My guess here is that the installer thought the underlayment used would account for the variances in the subfloor (assuming this is a floating install) and this was not the case. The best thing to do here would not be to force adhesive into the floor, but rather to pull the floor up, even out the subfloor using a self leveling compound or some grinding and then reinstalling the floor back over the newly leveled concrete.

Forcing adhesive into the floor could cause all sorts of problems. If the adhesive is not evenly applied over a smooth and flat floor evenly, slight flexes in the floor in areas without adhesive could begin to buckle or warp when the areas with adhesive do not move as the rest of the floor moves. Also, if the adhesive is injected in and cures with the floor over the top it could very well put excessive moisture into the floor as it cures and warp portions of the wood.

Normally with adhesives and wood flooring you can NOT do the wet-lay method. Typically the adhesive must cure to a tacky consistency before flooring is laid into it. Otherwise vapor from the curing adhesive will be absorbed by the wood and can cause warping.

Again, the best thing here would be to remove the floor, level out the concrete, then reinstall the concrete. Do NOT inject adhesive in specific areas as this could be devastating to your floor if this was floating.

Now, in the case where this floor was glued down, a different scenario is occurring. Now if this was done as a glue down what you are encountering is air pockets and drilling then injecting adhesive is fairly common. What your installer will need to ensure to do is to put down some wax paper or resin paper after plugging the drill hole and applying some weight to the injected area to ensure it removes the air pocket properly and adheres to the flooring.

This should remove your noise and make sure the floor serves you for many years. If you choose to not have this done, it is very likely the lack of bond in this area will slowly begin to travel up the floor and you will encounter boards coming loose and eventually popping up.

End result: If this was glued down, your installer is suggesting the proper course of action to fix it. If this floor was floating, then injecting adhesive into certain areas would be very bad for the floor.

January 29, 2008

Engineered Hardwood Install Question

Q: I'd like to install an engineered hardwood floor over the linoleum in my kitchen. The flooring would also extend into the area between the kitchen and the next room; sort of a hallway. That area has a rise of about 1.5 to 2 inches over its 8 feet. How do I install the floor with this change in flatness?

A: This is actually fairly easy to account for with a bit of careful measure work. First off, you will want to ensure that this rise is nice and smooth, if it angles off at on end of the rise (top or bottom) you will simply need to account for this.

The flooring itself should be installed width-wise along the rise as this will make it much easier to account for the change in elevation. If the rise is nice and smooth the whole way it will make your installation fairly easy. Spend plenty of time dry racking out the boards in this area and use the measure twice before you cut once way of thinking.

Now, if your floor angles off at either side of the rise you can account for this in one of two ways. One method would be to smooth out the angle via grinding down (top of the rise) or by adding a bit of material to smooth out the angle (bottom side of rise).

The other way to account for angles would be to measure the area and cut an appropriate angle into the board which will sit over this area. Again, measure twice, cut once and dry rack the floor out carefully to ensure all of the joints marry up nicely. I would suggest beginning your installation at the board which will be cut as this will help to ensure each area of the rise marries up nicely and that the floor is installed to take the rise into account. Keep in mind, this will require a bit of work to properly map out the install so that you keep your floor installed nice and straight as it spreads out toward the rest of the walls.

Since you intend to install over your current linoleum my guess is that you will be floating this floor, if not, you will want to remove the linoleum and any remaining adhesive residue before beginning your installation.

February 5, 2008

Concrete Joint Preparation for Flooring Install

Q: I am going to install an engineered wood floor (Kahrs-Woodloc Original Collection - 15mm) in my basement. I understand some self leveling compound can be used if needed in certain areas to ensure the floor is flat, but my question is how to handle the "crack control joints" that are cut into the floor. In certain areas, the joint will be perpendicular to the floor boards and I'm not as concerned, but in other areas the joint will be parallel to the boards and I'm wondering whether I may run into future problems if one of the flooring board joints lies over a concrete joint providing less support. The concrete is 9 years old and overall in excellent shape. The control joints are around 1/4" wide, but the edges are rounded over making them appear ~1/2" wide at the top surface.

Thanks for your advice.
Scott Roehrborn

A: As long as you account for these control joints in the concrete you should be fine to install the Kahrs floor floating over the top. If possible, try to ensure that the gaps run along the center of a plank rather than very close to the locking area of the planks. Luckily the Kahrs woodloc features nice wide planks, so you should have little issue here.

If you are concerned about particular joints which run parallel to the planks, you can use a piece of shim or some self leveler to fill these gaps. Depending on the underlayment you are using, you should have little worry about these control gaps as the concrete is fairly new. If you are using a relatively dense underlayment like cork or sound 6, you should have no issues at all here.

February 10, 2008

Hardwood in a Basement

Q: I would like to install a light maple hardwood floor in my basement, poured in 2000 and is level. From reading your responses to other questions the steps I need to take are: cleaning, sealing and taping, then adding a moisture barrier, getting a moisture reading of less than 5%, applying an adhesive and letting that cure for one month and I need to making sure the hardwood is 5/16” and engineered and at least 2000 hardness.

Am I headed in the right direction?

Sincerely,
Shana

A: Looks like you have a great start. A few notes I would like to give you that will help your process. For maple, Hard Maple has a hardness of 1410, so that means you won't find a maple with 2000+ hardness, but 1410 is still very good and should do the trick for you.

As far as what products to look into, you can do either a floating or glue down application and you will want to use either an engineered floor which is approved for basements (generally all engineered floors are) or a 5/16" solid floor.

Now if you are planning to put any heavier furniture over this floor, you will want to glue down the floor. This would be something like a large entertainment stand, fish tanks, pool tables or similar furniture. Now if this will be an area with normal furniture like couches and tables you can look into a floating floor and you should be ok.

Let's talk subfloor preparation. First you will want to ensure the concrete is nice and level, which you already have covered. Then make sure to test the moisture content. You will want to have it less than 8% and hopefully around 5-6%. Give your flooring plenty of time to acclimate, and test it for moisture content. When you flooring is within 2% of the moisture content of your subfloor it is ready for installation. So if your subfloor is at 6% and your flooring is 5-8% you are all set for installation.

For a moisture barrier and tape, this is only necessary if you are floating the floor. You will then install a 6mil poly vapor barrier (basically thin plastic for the floor) and you will want to carefully tape the seams of the barrier. Afterward you will lay down your underlayment and then install your floor.

For a glue down application, the adhesive acts a moisture barrier, so all you need to do is trowel out your glue, allow it to get to a tacky consistency then being laying your flooring. This is usually done in small areas at a time, about 2-3 rows worth depending on the width of the floor - very wide floors you will typically down about 2 rows at a time, where floors which are 5" or less you will trowel out enough adhesive to do about 3 rows before beginning on row 1.

Once your installation is complete, you will want to give the floor about 24-48 hours before moving heavier furniture into the room (especially glue down floors) just to make sure the room has plenty of time to settle and in the case of glue, the adhesive has time to cure. A month is much longer than truly needed, but after about a month the floor will have completely acclimated to its current state and you will then just want to ensure you keep a regular maintenance routine to keep the floor in tip top shape. Also, remember to use furniture cups under contact points of furniture to the floor or use area rugs (for table this tends to be a nice touch). These will help protect your floor from scratches from your furniture and you should be using felt pads at the very least, though I prefer full furniture cups.

Beyond these few tips, you are all set to go, but let me offer one final tip here. Always remember, measure twice before you cut once and give your floor plenty of time to acclimate. Also be patient during the installation and you will end up with a beautiful floor as a reward.

February 29, 2008

Movement in a Floating Engineered Floor

Q: I recently purchased the engineered wood red oak flooring from Pergo (5 inches and 3/8 thick). It is to be floated. I hired an installer and noticed that several planks give a little when I walk over them. Is this normal with floating floors. Or should I try other options like nailing them down to the floor? Will it hurt that part of the floor is floated by part of it is nailed. Any ideas would help.

Thanks,
Nav

A: All floating floors will move some as they are not solidly anchored to the floor. Usually this movement is very subtle and difficult to feel unless you are specifically looking for it. Now if you are feeling a decent amount of movement, such as being able to see a gap as the floor flexes underfoot, then this can be a problem.

All floating floors have a tolerance for movement and certain underlayments allow a floor to move more than others. Dense underlayments like Cork allow for a bit less movement than the cheaper foam based underlayments.

With the Pergo floor you have installed, this floor should have been glued in the tongue and groove sections when floated, so if you are hearing any pop noises or are able to see into the joints when the floor moves, this can be a problem.

What is most likely happening is that part of your subfloor has a small valley that sits lower than the rest of the subfloor and the floor is flexing down into that valley as you walk over it. Typically this is taken care of with a bit of subfloor prep before installing the floor and although floating floors can account for a small variance in subfloor height it is still best to level out the floor before going forward with installation.

I would not suggest nailing portions of the floor, as this will prevent the floor from being able to move which floating floors are designed to do. This means that the portions of floor which can move could buckle or warp as they move and other portions do not. At the very least, your can run into problems with gapping as the floor expands and contracts.

In the end, I would have your installer return and check the areas in question. If the movement is within the tolerance limits of the floor, then there is no need to repair. If this movement is beyond tolerance, the precise cause should be found and remedied, which is most likely going to require a small amount of work leveling a portion of the subfloor.

March 11, 2008

Bruce Locking Hardwood Over Concrete

Q: We recently decided to pull up our carpeting and install hardwood flooring on the rest of our home's ground floor. There is currently Bruce engineered hardwood flooring that the builder installed using a glue-down method. Unfortunately, several of these boards crack and pop right at the threshold. We're convinced that there was not enough adhesive used, and so decided that we would do a floating install for the remainder to be safe. We had previously done a floating install at our old house, and it came out great. However, that house had a wood subfloor.

So, we purchased the correct amount Bruce Lock-&-Fold flooring and the 2-in-1 underlayment from Lowes. We couldn't find any Armstrong or Bruce underlayment, and just assumed that the generic brand they had would be adequate. We prepped the den by pulling up the carpet and pad, and removing the tack strips. We then put down the underlayment as specified in the installation instructions with the flooring and began laying the floor. We're 2/3 done, and while the floor looks great it sounds terrible. It's like walking on a bed of Rice Krispies, and the floor noticably depresses wherever you step.

We know that we cleaned and prepped the subfloor correctly, so we're wondering if the generic underlayment could be the culprit? In looking through the Bruce installation instructions, we noticed that it calls for Bruce ComfortGuard, Armstrong Quiet Comfort or Quiet Comfort Premium underlayment. However, we can't find it at Lowes or Home Depot. Will either of those underlayments take care of this problem? We noticed that you seem to recommend cork underlayment a lot, and we're curious if maybe that would help our situation?

The project is currently on hold until we can figure out what to do about the sound and "bounciness" of the flooring. We've already spent quite a bit on this flooring. If we have to spend a little extra to get proper underlayment that's fine. We're just afraid that we'll keep throwing more money at this and wind up with a floor that looks great but drives us crazy when we walk on it.

Thanks.
Ken & Crystal

A: With any floating floor there are a few things that you need to keep in mind. First of all, underlayment will only account for variances in subfloor height of up to 1/16" and typically only the premium underlayments do this well. With the 2-in-1 and 3-in-1 underlayments you typically have a very thing and inexpensive foam underlayment, so getting quite a bit of noise and spring from the floor is common.

The Armstrong Quiet Comfort is a fairly good underlayment sitting a step below cork 3mm cork. In this case as long as your subfloor is rather even and does not need to be leveled, then the problem here is most likely the underlayment. I would suggest changing out to at least one of the suggested underlayments if not 3mm or 6mm cork or Sound 6. I tend to lean on cork as its natural density (amongst other qualities) removes much of the spring felt in most floating floors while also reducing the noise considerably, make the floor sound and feel much more like a nail down solid floor.

Keep in mind you will need to have a moisture barrier, so if you are using another foam underlayment, such as the Bruce/Armstrong stuff or Sound 6, you can leave your 2-in-1 in place then install the new underlayment over the top, but if you use cork, you will need just moisture barrier and I would avoid using the 2-in-1. The reason behind this is that the density of cork gets somewhat removed when a softer underlayment is laid under it, so it will have a bit more spring than the cork alone.

March 16, 2008

Installation Question - New Floor and a Grand Piano

Q: I am going to have my parquet floor with new hardwood floor in my living room, which houses a small concert grand piano. The subfloor is concrete, and my floor installer says that I should go for engineered hard wood strips. My question is: should the floor be floated or glued down to the subfloor? I am worried that if the floor is floated, then it could serve as another big sounding board for my piano and this will disturb my neighbors. I live in an old condo. With my current floor, my neighbors have not complained, but I need to make sure that I can minimize the transmission of sounds (it is more of vibration than impact sound).

Thank you and look forward to hearing from you.

A: My first bit of advice would be to check with your HOA for any regulations required when installing a wood floor in a condo. Usually this requires certain underlayments, typically most HOAs require cork, to absorb the sound from the floor. This being said a floating floor can be a great option as it will need underlayment; however, having a concert grand piano over this floor leaves me to worry a bit.

The best set up for such a heavy furnishing on a floor is to have it solidly anchored to the floor, so I would honestly suggest going with a glue down application. This might mean needing to glue down a cork underlayment (do not use foam based underlayments when gluing down) then glue the floor down over the top of the underlayment. Again, I stress that you check with your HOA before you proceed to ensure you meet their sound requirements. Typically, gluing down 6mm cork then gluing down a floor will meet all HOA requirements while getting exactly what you will need to place your piano on this floor.

March 28, 2008

Mullican Chalmette Provincial Hickory - Glue or Float?

Q: I will have two questions:

1) I will have Mullican Chalmette Provincial Hickory Engineered wood installed. Have you seen this laid down up close? Does it look real? I have only seen the store sample and it looks very nice, but it's so hard to tell from such a small sample.

2) It will be installed on a slab foundation. Right now there is very cheap laminate flooring that does not look good and will be pulled up. I have asked several people and get different opinions on whether to float it or not. Some say it will feel and sound more solid if glued. Others say it will not have a clicking sound if floated and this is the better method. I don't want to float if it will be noisy. What do you think is the best method on a slab? And would it be possible to reuse the pad that is probably under the cheap laminate (whatever it is)?

Thank You,

Chris

A: Mullican's Chalmette hand-sculpted collection is a great engineered floor. I have not seen this specific floor installed up close, but I have seen several Mullican floors and they look real simply because they are. Unlike a laminate floor the top 1/8" or so of these floors is the actual wood species and the hand sculpting is real as well. Laminate which is a picture, will repeat here and there, but the Mullican product you have is actual wood, meaning you see real variation in the grain and some slight difference in the shade of each plank, just like you should see in any real hardwood floor.

Now let's talk about installation options over your concrete slab. The method of installation you choose will depend upon what you expect out of your floor. If you intend to place heavy furniture like an entertainment center or bookcases on the floor you should have this floor glued down. Floating floors are great, but not suited for heavy furniture. Now all hardwood floors will have a bit louder sound to them as you walk over them compared to carpet, but any floor which is solidly anchored like nail down and glue down floors will have a more solid sound. You can also get a better sound from floating floors which have high quality underlayment. If the sound of the floor is very important to you, you can do a process which is done in condos. First get a cork underlayment (only cork should be done this way), glue the cork down then glue your floor over the top of the cork. HOAs have strict requirements for sound when it comes to flooring in a condo and this is usually the only way most Condo owners can get a non-floating hardwood floor installed.

If you do not intend to have heavy furniture in this room, floating can work very well, but to get the best feel out of your floor it is critical that you used a good underlayment. The issue with the Mullican floor is that it is a tongue and groove floor, meaning that you will need to use a tongue and groove glue to properly connect the floor together. Basically put, you will lay a small bead of glue into the groove of each plank then install the next plank ensuring the glue properly spreads around the entire tongue of the plank being installed. When floating any hardwood I highly suggest using a very dense underlayment, 6mm cork being the best bet, as it minimizes the springy feeling of floating floors which gives the feel of a nail down hardwood. 6mm cork also removes a great deal of the clicky or hollow noise in floating floors, making them sound solid, but typically not overly noisy. Keep in mind that if you install you floor using the floating method you MUST use a moisture barrier along with your underlayment - if you do not your warranty will be instantly voided.

If you are having this installed by a professional who is experience with glue down floors, gluing the floor will be your best bet overall as it will be better suited for heavier furniture. If you intend to install this floor yourself I would highly suggest avoiding a glue down floor at all costs as they are the most likely installation type to fail when done by your average DIYer.

April 26, 2008

Flooring for a 3-Season Porch

Q: I have an existing 3-season porch/sunroom (completely enclosed but no heat or air conditioning) and I want to finish the floor... It's currently just a plywood subfloor and I'm looking for good flooring suggestions. I like the look of cork and also considered laminate but I don't know if these materials will stand up to the seasonal temperature changes (I live in Minnesota). Any suggestions will be appreciated.

Joe

A: Despite being fully enclosed, with the temperature changes you can expect to see in Minnesota it can be a bit much for a wood floor. Your best bet would be something like a stone/tile or vinyl floor.

Cork can be effective here, but you will want to ensure the floor is well acclimated before installation. With a floating cork, be ready to seem some minor gaps in winter as the planks contract from the cold.

You could also look into an engineered hardwood as the plies will help to prevent some expansion and contraction; however, much like I mentioned with cork, be prepared to see some gaps. Also, make sure plenty of expansion room is left around the perimeter of the floor for the summer months. Much like engineered, laminate has potential here, but expect the same problems.

Overall your safest bet would be something like vinyl or stone, but if you want cork or hardwood it can be done, you just need to be prepared for what the changes in season will do to the floor without climate control and ensure plenty of expansion room is left around the edges of the floor.

April 29, 2008

Bellawood or Pergo?

Q: What are the differences between bellawood and pergo? Which would you recommend over a concrete subfloor?

Chris

A: From the start here we are trying to compare apples to oranges, but let's delve into why.

Pergo is a manufacturer of laminate flooring. Pergo was the first to introduce laminate to the US market and has since become synonymous with laminate to the average floor buyer in the US. Laminate flooring is a photo-realistic picture of wood, laminated to a backer board and medium or high-density fiberboard core. Although a wood product by nature, as the core and photo come from wood they are not traditional wood floors sawn from trees and then milled. Unlike traditional wood floors, laminate flooring is exceptionally tough and can be installed virtually anywhere. Pergo itself is the biggest name in the laminate industry and makes many various lines from their Everyday collection, which is built as a economy line, to Pergo Select, which is one of the best laminates in the industry, Pergo's selection has a floor to fit just about any situation or budget.

Bellawood is a private flooring manufacturer owned by Lumber Liquidators. They make solid hardwood flooring in various species much like the myriad of wood flooring manufacturers out there like Bruce, Kahrs, Westhollow and many more. The major downside to solid wood flooring is that it is not as durable as laminate and it is limited to where it can be installed. In your case, the only solid hardwood which can be installed over a concrete subfloor is 5/16" solid and it must be glued down.

In your case I would suggest looking into a laminate floor, such as the ones made by Pergo, but if you want a real wood floor, look into engineered wood floors like those made by Bellefloor (not to be confused with Bellawood), Sun Paratech, Saso, Westhollow or Kahrs.

May 9, 2008

Flooring a Kitchen - Hardwood or Laminate?

Q: I want to re-do my kitchen floor, which would be best hardwood floor or laminate in a wood grain?

A: When it comes to kitchens, nearly any floor can work very well as long as certain precautions are taken. Any consumer wants to have the best, but to be honest this is hardly situational as far as a "best" is concerned, but most of it ends up being opinion. Let's examine the pros and cons of each flooring in a kitchen.

Laminate is great anywhere in a home because it is durable and built for traffic and abuse. If you have concerns about dents from dropping something on your floor, laminate might be your best choice as it is more dent and abrasion resistant that traditional wood flooring. The only downside to laminate in a kitchen is that it can not be installed underneath appliances or cabinetry because it is a floating floor. Floating floors are not meant to hold this much weight at edges of the floor and doing so would cause massive problems in the floor, making it fail.

For hardwood I would heavily suggest looking into an engineered floor. If your subfloor is concrete you can NOT install a 3/4" solid hardwood over concrete. Also, since a kitchen is a moisture rich environment when compared to other portions of the house, I would highly suggest an engineered as it is more resistant to expansion and contraction due to the cross-play lamination techniques used to make them. The biggest problem you will run into with a engineered wood floor is that depending on the species you choose, it will be more prone to denting from dropped objects. Also, much like any wood floor, including laminate, spilled water must be cleaned up ASAP or it can get into the floor and cause problems.

Regardless of what floor you choose, I would suggest you look into adding a small bead of glue in the joints of your floor to add a small amount of extra moisture sealant. In the end here, if you expect items to be dropped from time to time or you have children, I would suggest looking into laminate. If your home is solely adult with little worry of spills and dropped items then hardwood can be an excellent option. Again I stress that "best" is almost entirely opinion as there are so many choices out there to be made and each has its benefit based on situations.

May 11, 2008

Bruce Engineered Floor - Subfloor Prep for Glue Down Install

Q: I am installing a Bruce engineered hardwood floor over a concrete slab. When the house was built and the base board was painted, the painters left quite a bit of overspray on the concrete slab. Does this overspray need to be removed so that the glue will adhere properly to the slab.

My next question is, if it does need to be removed, what is the easiest way to get it up ? I have a floor scrapper, however its not removing the paint.

Thanks,
Rich

A: Overspray is pretty common when it comes to any paint work to be done, and a rare number of painters prep to prevent it from getting on subfloors. You will need to remove the overspray in order to ensure proper bond from your adhesive - so let's dig into just how to remove it.

Scraping can be a real pain and as you are experiencing does not always do the trick. I would suggest looking into renting a floor sander to grind the paint off or use a chemical paint stripper. Typically any paint stripper found in a local home store will do the trick, but it can help to use an abrasive pad of some form (even something like a Brillo pad) will help to speed the stripping process. If you use a sander, there will be dust, so wear a respirator or at least a basic dust mask.

Once you have removed the overspray, ensure the subfloor is clean, flat and dry before you begin your installation with the adhesive otherwise it will lead to a head ache and repairs in the future.

May 29, 2008

Click Type Hardwood Floors

Q: My handyman told me that there is a new type of installation for hardwood floors - click - no glue, no nails and that the finish is strong and durable.

Is that true? Is that option now available for hardwood installation on a concrete base? If so, is that type installation limited to certain types of wood? Thanks.

A: Your handyman is correct, there have been quite a few innovations to hardwood flooring in the last couple of decades, one of which being click-together engineered hardwood floors. The selection of engineered lines featuring a click-together system is somewhat limited, but a couple of them are very well done, namely Kahrs and Saso. Kahrs Woodloc is one of the most well known click-together hardwood flooring systems in the world, and several of their collections are some of the best floors available. Saso has one of the most user friendly locking systems in the industry along with a very nice wear layer and cross-ply substrate, making their floors both easy to install and built to last.

As far as installing over concrete is concerned, this can be done with all of the floating hardwood floors which click-together, but keep in mind you still MUST have a moisture barrier as well as underlayment in order to do the job. Due to these floors being engineered you have no species limitations for installing over concrete, but make sure you are setting your own expectations properly. This means you should not expect a softer species (like American Walnut) to be super dent resistant.

One suggestion I do have is to ensure you get a good, dense underlayment under a floating hardwood floor. 6mm cork is the best bet as it removes virtually all of the "spring" out of floating floors, making them feel like traditional solid wood floors while also reducing a good portion of the noise. Cheaper underlayments will cause you to feel more movement in the floor under foot, although this is typically within tolerance, it can be a real hassle if you do not properly level out your subfloor.

June 6, 2008

Shaw Engineered Floors

Q: We got a decent price on upgrading the flooring in our new home from carpet to an engineered wood floor. They offer mannington, bruce, and shaw. The sample we liked was Shaw.

What is your opinion of Shaw?
Tony

A: Shaw is one of the largest flooring manufacturers in the world. Shaw has a good selection of floors to choose from, ranging from more economical choices to higher quality collections. Overall Shaw has a good variety of products and makes some very good floors including a great mix of domestic and exotic species.

When it comes to engineered floors, Mannington makes some of the best lines in the industry. Superior substrate construction makes Mannington's floors excellent when it comes to resisting expansion and contraction. The downside with Mannington is that you have a bit more limit with species choices, as they focus primarily on domestic species like oak and hickory.

Bruce on the other hand has an amazing selection, which at times seems almost too much. Like Shaw you get a great range of flooring from economical to high end, but there is a big focus on domestic species with a bit less exotic species choices than Shaw.

Overall, Shaw is a great choice for flooring, but I would highly suggest looking into one of the higher grade lines, as these tend to have a superior finish and feature a better substrate.

June 13, 2008

Kahrs Hardwood Floor - Warped Boards

Q: I am in the process of installing hardwood floor (Kahrs Brazilian Cherry) in our home, and some of the boards are significantly warped out of the box. I called Kahrs technical support line here in the US and asked what is considered tolerable when it comes to the straightness of hardwood floor boards, but he didnʼt want to give me any detailed information. I mentioned that one of the boards is so significantly warped that I can put my hand underneath it, and I measured the distance from the middle to the ground to be approximately 1 inch. When asked if this number would be acceptable, the customer representative mentioned that it is, which of course left me puzzled as I consider 1 inch unacceptable.

I was wondering if there are hard numbers above which a board is considered warped and defect. I have attached some pictures which illustrate the situation.

Thanks so much for your help,
Gilbert

A: Typically when boards are bowed as much as the ones you have received, replacements are in order from the retailer who sold them. Typically this comes with a claims process of some form. This being said, boards in similar conditions have been installed in the past successfully and there are some ways to relieve this kind of bowing.

Any established numbers would have to come directly from the manufacturer of the product, as it is their duty to determine what is and is not within tolerances. If a member of that company who has proper authorization says it is within tolerance, then I would get some documentation just to ensure your warranty remains intact.

One method suggested by Gene D., iFLOOR's commercial contract manager, for repairing a bow like this involves a simple hand-held clothing steam-iron and a towel. Wrap the towel around the iron, then dial up the steam and begin ironing out the board from the center, working outward. The heat will help to relieve the board's bowing. This is much like the process used to form wood for ships or furniture, a careful application of heat and steam will help to form the board.

Now if this process is a bit too slow for your liking, then install the board and glue, but once the board is in place, before the adhesive cures, use a sand bag to weight down the board so that the adhesive cures with the board in a flat position, locking it in. You can make your own sand bags if you want smaller bags that are a bit more form fitting for the board.

Personally I would first contact the retailer you purchased the flooring from and request replacements. If the retailer can confirm these boards are within tolerance, and provide documentation, then either install them and bag the boards down or do the repair method using an iron before installing.

June 27, 2008

Waxing Engineered Floors

Q: We have just installed an engineered floor in our small basement bathroom.

We love the lush and exotic look, and our GC advised us to investigate waxing it to help prevent water from seeping in between the cracks between the boards. The floor is installed over a radiant heat system.

What wax do you recommend (I'll guess a paste wax) and where can we find it?

Ronald H.

A: Unless this particular floor has a wax finish i would highly suggest not waxing the floor. Over pre-finished floors or floors featuring any non-wax finish, when you apply wax to the floor you are likely to get a dull or cloudy appearance over your floor. The reason for this is that the wax does not truly get into the floor, like it would with a wax finish, so it sits over the top and distorts the appearance of the actual finish, rather than adding a gloss level.

As a general rule, do not use any cleaner which has wax or is oil-based over pre-finished wood floors or wood floors without a similar finish to the cleaner (wax finish for wax, oil finish for oil-based cleaners). This includes cleaners like Minwax, Murphy's Oil Soap and similar products.

As far as a cleaner is concerned, I would suggest looking into the hardwood cleaner made by BonaKemi or ask your floor's manufacturer for what they suggest. When it comes to sealing in order to be safe there are two things you can do here. For best effect (though it takes time and a bit of cash), you could screen the floor and apply 2-3 coats of fresh finish over the top of the floor. This type of site finish work helps to get an even layer of finish and sheen over the entire floor after its installation is complete. The alternative here would be to get a color-matched sealant, preferably one which is semi-elastic, and put a small amount of the sealant in the seams.

Now most of this work is not necessary as long as some basic precautions are taken. First thing is to ensure a proper mat is near any showers or bath tubs, this will help to prevent excess water from getting on the floor. Clean up any spills asap and prevent standing water or wet clothing from sitting on the floor. With a few precautions, you should massively limit any chance of water damage to your floor.

July 15, 2008

Hardwood Flooring Over Radiant Heat

Q: Hi good morning, we have a concrete floor in our walkout basement we are putting in an apartment I would love to have hardwood flooring we have radiant heat under the concrete please advise what wood and also at a reasonable price. Sq FT is 850.

Thanks,
Marie

A: Your best bet here is to look into an engineered hardwood floor which is suitable for radiant heat, which most are. Your best bet is to look into some of the higher quality ones which have better built substrates, as this will be far better suited to radiant heat. Good choices here are Saso, Bellefloor, Sun Paratech, Westhollow and Kahrs. If you can float the floor, Saso or Kahrs being great here, this will be your best option, but ensure it is installed over a dense underlayment such as cork or sound 6. You can do glue-down, but many floors have very strict requirements for doing a glue-down floor over radiant heat, but not impossible.

Another good option here would be to look into laminate or cork. Both are suitable for radiant heat and in the case of cork, I would suggest using the floating cork floors over glue-down.

If you want to go for the best bang for your buck, look into Saso for engineered hardwood, Westhollow for Cork, and for Laminate try Quick Step, Pergo or Westhollow.

July 17, 2008

Gluing vs Stapling

Q: I am interested in purchasing some engineered flooring. I have installed engineered flooring before that could be glued or stapled down. I chose to staple the flooring down. I see on the website some of the engineered floors must be glued down and cannot be stapled. What is the reason for this?

Thanks,
Jon

A: A majority of engineered floors can be both stapled and glued down, but in some cases manufacturers will not approve a floor for stapling and its only suitable installation method is to glue. The primary reason tends to be floor thickness. You'll notice most flooring which is only suited for glue-down installation is 5/16" and this tends to be a risky floor for staples as they are too likely to blow through the tongue.

This also tends to be the case with parquet floors, where they are only approved for a glue down installation. If you would prefer to staple-down your engineered floor, look for one that is a bit thicker. You can also look into some of the click-together floating engineered hardwood floors out there rather than looking into a glue down floor.

July 24, 2008

Floating Hardwood Meets Stair

Q: I'm going to install Mannington Caspian 5" LocNgo and I have a problem with the hallway. One side of the hall is wall, the other meets the molding to the railing overlooking stairs. The easiest solution would be to lay a board flush with the molding and the milled straight edge should look fine against the molding. By doing so however, a 1 inch strip of floor will be required on the wall end. I think 1 inch is too small. I don't want to rip the plank that hits the stair molding because I don't think the cut will be straight enough. The floor and banister molding are the same height. Do you have any ideas? Is there some molding that I could put between the railing molding and the floor that isn't as wide as a T-molding or end cap?

Thank you for any advice.
KC

I did some quick follow-up in order to get a couple of photos of the hallway and stair. Here's what KC sent along:

Attached are 2 pictures. The width of the wood where the balusters are inserted is 6 inches.

I've thought of another idea which would mean replacing that piece of wood with 5.25 landing tread that would go all the way across. That would take care of the step down to the stair as well, but entail a lot of work with the railing. I should also mention that the hallway width at the newel is 37 inches and at the wall end of the rail is 36 inches.

Here you can see the hallway and